Monday, September 3, 2012

My thoughts today...


  1. Replies
    1. i know. it is so powerful. The most tear jerking moment is when the woman tentatively and so humbly reaches for Him. Everytime I watch it, I crumble.

  2. forgiveness is such a special feeling,so beautiful and tender to be able to pass over what is ugly transgression and reach a place of peaceful healing....not always easy but always possible.

  3. I needed to see this.

  4. That was from Passion of the Christ, right?

    Forgiveness was a toughie for me but once I started really challenging myself with my step work, praying and really working on ME, it finally came.

    I hope you are doing well, April.

    1. really Elsie? Is it really possible, the full forgiveness. Sometimes i wonder if our relationship will always be tainted.

    2. It was possible for me. I don't know if it's possible for everyone. That's not to say I don't get angry at what he's done it means I understand and have moved past what he's done. I put a period at the end of it. I thought I had already done that long ago but I was wrong, I was still holding onto so much anger below the surface I was ready to lash out at anything he did or said, no matter how trivial, I was right there to point it out.

      It was when I worked on myself and with my counselor that I realized I was pissed off at myself for not seeing all that was happening in my marriage and then when I did see it, I buried my head in the sand for almost a year because I was to afraid to deal with it. And I didn't even know the extent of what was going on - I thought it *just* porn. (remember those days?)

      Once I forgave myself for coping the best way I could, I dealt with forgiving Devin. For real this time. I picked up each part of what he did, re-examined it piece by piece, wrote it about and then came to the conclusion that it wasn't him. It was the addiction. He didn't wake up and think, "How can I destroy my marriage today?" or "How can feel more shameful today", he's an addict no different than myself twenty years ago. So, I put a period on the affairs and promised myself if he cheated on me again I'd walk and I forgave him. I separated the addiction from my husband. It doesn't define him.

      I agree, the relationship will be tainted in some way because it's hard not to look at the past....

  5. this song has been on my mind since d-day.......i would love to post the link but i can't ...go to :REVERBNATION:ARTIST:Jordana :song title:your reason why.

    1. now it's going to be on my mind...thanks for sharing! :)

  6. I am a pharisee...and I need to remind myself when I am feeling bitter about what has happened, about what I have done myself.

    I was once the "other" woman...I have had inappropriate online emails and conversations and although its never come to fruition because that was my choice, I have to admit even going down the road half way is a terrible thing to do.

  7. Ah, forgiveness! If I can't ever forgive does that mean that I won't ever really, truly, deeply move beyond this mess? I believe that people make mistakes - we ALL do - but some mistakes, like my H's 6 month affair while I was prego with twins, feels like something unforgiveable to me, no matter how much I love(d?) him. I'm 19 months out (found out 5 days before my babies' birth - how convenient to constantly know the DDay - ugh) ... maybe that's not enough time though? Eager to hear your thoughts on forgiveness. I'm in a 'hard/unforgiving' place now, but 5 minutes from now might be in a 'softer' place - ah, the rollercoaster!

    1. Before I get started...Congrats on the twins!! I have secretly wanted to be the mother of twins my entire life. :) lucky girl. Not exactly the best timing for your husband philandering. A lot of us understand how that feels.
      It's moments like this that make me ask all the unanswered questions of why? why? WHY? and why? Why did he think that was ok?

      But, like so many tell me, there is no answer to the "why"...
      You're story is painful and I'm sorry you're there...I'm sorry for anyone who goes through that pain. And it does seem unforgivable.

      So, my thoughts on forgiveness...

      I'm not there yet. And honestly, its not really something that's on my mind. At this crossroads in my healing this video speaks to me about compassion and staying away from judgement. Maybe these things are precursors to forgiveness, paving the way.

      For now I find myself on a pretty solid path. I'm healing, growing, learning, changing, trusting myself and as long as I'm headed down this road I'm sure I'll run into forgiveness some day,right? It seems like a long term goal instead on something I need to do right now.

      I get feeling hard and unforgiving. If you've read this blog you'll see that I've been in that place of anger and cold bitterness. and yeah, its a bit of a rollercoaster but I can feel myself progressing, going through the different phases of recovery. Being hard and unforgiving is one of those phases. and there really isn't any reason to feel guilty or badly about those feelings.

      I'm a true believer in feeling them. They are there for a reason. When I work through my pain, my anger, resentment, sadness, harshness it brings me to a new place, and emotionally healthier place.

      in short, forgiveness is a place i will get to someday, but for now it isn't my focus.

      Oh Wow!!! It is crackin down some rain!!! I've got to go sit on the porch for a few minutes.

  8. Why do we need to label all our feelings?why do we make such a big deal about forgiveness?

    What is forgiveness, in any case?

    Not wanting to kill the person?

    Not wanting to destroy his life the way he destroyed ours?

    Is that forgiveness or is that just ensuring that we dont harm ourselves furthermore?

    Forgiveness doesnt change anything that has only allows everyone to feel better especially the perpetrator.

    lets not make a virtue out of it..its just the only practical way of dealing with a sick situation.

    Does it ensure that you wont have periodic bouts of anger,depression, way.

    Instead of focusing on forgiveness if we focus on building up our own self esteem recovery would be much quicker and long lasting.

    And to focus on rebuilding our own self esteem we need anger to motivate us..not anger towards the person,just anger towards the way we ignored all the red flags..and believe me whether we admit it or not all of us ignored huge fiery red ones.

    Not a corrosive debilitating anger but an anger which brings about a change..a change in ourselves for the better.

    Forgiveness is not possible unless you forget each and every single thing that has happened and that is not humanly possible.

    So lets not beat ourselves up if we cant forgive them...lets just move ahead and be done with the enitre sordidness

    1. I think you bring up some good points. After all, this is sex addiction, it's not like he washed your red socks will your whites...

      Kind of like I said above, I really believe in feeling our feelings, no matter what they are. Dare I say it...even that corrosive debilitating (politically/socially incorrect) anger. Although i feel that anger now, i will not carry it forever. it has a time and place. I think the key is to feel it, deal with it, keep our actions in check and then keep going. When I dwell and get lost that's when I fall off track and go leads down dark paths. insanity

      And like you said, there is no reason to beat ourselves up for it. Everything you feel is real.

      But i do believe forgiveness (some day) is an absolute outcome of healing my own heart. I will never forget this part of my life. i don't want to. i believe that even though I can remember---with vivid clarity---i can forgive. there is no pressure, there is no rush, this is my journey and i will get there.

      So yes, I think what you said is the key "Instead of focusing on forgiveness if we focus on building up our own self esteem recovery would be much quicker and long lasting."

      almost as if our own self-worth lends its way to forgiveness.

      what do you think?

  9. Interesting discussion! I agree, Anonymous, that we needn't label our feelings but I have a hunch that that 'hard' feeling I get of 'I can't believe that my best friend turned out to be such an a-hole... to ME! I can't believe that the person I thought I knew so deeply could DO IT with another person over & over & over... while I was pregnant with OUR first children (twins). I can't believe that we used to talk about how 'different' we were and felt immune to such things! I can't believe, I can't believe, I can't believe..." This thinking makes me intensely ANGRY, which is a feeling the good culturally-Catholic me doesn't feel comfortable with. But I've had 19 months to get comfortable :-) and I'm pretty good at it now. But I don't want to live like this forever. I don't want to hate the father of my children. I don't want to laugh & feel a love feeling and then stop myself and think 'don't even look at that a-hole who stuck himself in that ugly b-tch over & over & over'. That's the hard me that *I* am getting sick of. Somehow I think forgiveness (whatever that is & whatever that means) would help. There's no time table, to be sure, but I would like some real, not just fleeting, softness to be more of a fixture in my perspective on life. I think I know all the 'whys' of why he did what he did, how our marriage was when he did what he did, how the perfect storm was created, and yes, even though this is not my fault, how my role in our relationship made the insecure-him feel a certain way which led him to make the bad decisions he made. I've spent A LOT of time in therapy & in discussions with my H to figure out all those whys. But the hate & hurt are still there... duller, yes (thank God)!, but still present. I've accepted that this happened in my life but haven't forgiven and moved on, whatever that means.

    Eager to hear others' thoughts!

    1. Funny, I'm in the same place you are. Trying to get out of the hard and into the soft. It's like a thaw...from a deep ice age. Like you, I'm getting over being pissed.

  10. So my thoughts after reading all the comments - no - shame on me I have not yet watched the video but I do know the story - & yes I plan to watch the video nice - run-on sentence.

    So anyway - my thoughts are:

    1) I am not sure what complete forgiveness really looks & feels like, I'm afraid, on the giving or reciving end. Not sure I ever will.

    2.) With the above said, the idea of complete forgiveness is interesting. For me, that means it's perfect forgiveness. And I am pretty sure while there are some things we can be perfect in - in this lifetime - I'm not sure this is one of them. At least for me. And this is just a my thoughts tonight as I read all this - never looked at it like this before - so I am trying these ideas on for size as we speak. However, just like everything else I am not perfect in - this is where the Savior's Atonement takes over once more for all my flaws, shortcomings, & sins. Hope I'm making some sense.

  11. This is some good shit, Ladies!
    I see a little of me in each one of you.
    Elsie: I thought I could forgive him. I really wanted to, but then I jumped back on the rage train because I felt like I let him off the hook. It was too easy.
    Xena: I am also not perfect. Made some lousy choices right after DDay. Let he who is without sin cast the first stone. Bet I won't have to dodge too many rocks being tossed my way.
    Erica: The coaster hasn't stopped for me either, but it has slowed down. I don't see forgiveness playing a role in the speed or length of the ride. I like the idea of forgiveness being off the table. I think true forgiveness requires concrete feelings. Those of us on the coaster are not privy to stable emotions.
    S: I'm with you. I don't see how I can find forgiveness. I can't imagine what it would feel like. That's why, for me, I'm just gonna take it off the table. For now, anyway.
    Scabs: I wear my feelings on my sleeve. I let them fly up high for all to witness. It ain't always pretty, but if I held them in or ignored them, the consequences could be dire! ;-)
    I need to feel them, pick them apart and work to understand them, then maybe I can move forward to where ever the coaster takes me next.
    Thanks for conversation. Wish we could do a girls' night out!!

  12. Thank you thank you thank you ladies. Really. I feel somewhat closer to resolution. Like there is a clarity just beyond my reach. I think that what has been holding me back is fear of being a fool. The fear that someone will look at me, taking him back, forgiving and letting go, and think, she's so stupid.
    But, I read your stories and statements and I realize, you aren't being stupid. You are taking a huge risk putting your psyche, your heart and your soul on the line. But it's not foolish, it's incredibly brave.
    And Scabs, I so needed to see this clip. Maybe my husband doesn't deserve to be put back up on the pedestal I used to keep him on, but I have to stop throwing stones at him.

    1. That's huge isn't it? I mean, really, what kind of woman accepts a man like that back in her life. but whether we can or not take them back forgiveness seems possible. And i can stop throwing stones at him too (geez, why are they such an easy target lol)

  13. Thanks Scabs for the video and everyone for your thoughts...I'm miles and miles away from forgiveness although I know that it has to come eventually. Like others have said, not necessarily for him, but for ME. I can't move on and move forward if I forever have this anger and hate in my heart. I also know that I'm not perfect - although I'm a lot closer to perfect than my hubby ;) - and I would hope to be forgiven for the stupid things I do too. But, I'm not forcing anything and I'm going to let myself take my sweet time because right now that's all I can do.

    1. I agree, everything has a time...forgiveness may not be now.

  14. Just a the Miracle of Forgiveness, Spencer W. Kimball says this story has nothing to do with forgiveness. All Christ does is tell her to go forward and repent. Forgiveness from God cannot come without full repentence. As for all of us we are required to forgive, but as humans it definitely takes time. We will not be truly free to progress though until we do forgive.



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